Understanding Contracts, Privacy Policies, and Trademarks

Today's Throwback Thursday episode features the brilliant legal mind of my friend, Nicole Cheri Oden. Nicole says that legal is self-care for your business and I couldn't agree more.

How do you know if you or your business needs legal help? What are the best contracts for your business? How can trademarks help protect your brand?

Legal is a must for all small businesses. Legal will help you prevent costly mistakes and protect your business's assets.

Listen in and take notes.

Visit Nicole:

Template Shop: https://nicolecherioden.com/legal-shop/

Mini-Course: https://nicolecherioden.com/legal-basics/

Law Office: https://nicolecheriodenlaw.com/ 

You can also connect with Nicole on:

Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/nicolecheriodenlaw/ 

LinkedIn - https://www.linkedin.com/in/nicole-cheri-oden/ 

 
Thanks for tuning in to Collab with Kiva.

Are you ready to take massive action in your business and make data-driven decisions? Click the button below and let’s chat 👇🏽

Podcast transcript:

Kiva Slade: [00:00:01]

Hello, and welcome to collab with Kiva. I'm your host, Kiva Slade. From the marbled halls of the US Congress to my racing-themed office chair, I've learned that there is no perfect path to the life of your dreams. My journey over the past 20 years has included being a legislative director for a member of Congress, policy director for a nonprofit, stay-at-home mom, homeschooling mom, jewelry business owner, and now the owner of a service-based business. Whether your journey has been a straight line or full of zigs and zags, join me and my guest as we share insights, hope, and lessons learned from our female entrepreneurship journeys. May the collaborative sharing of our stories be the tide that lifts your boat. Let's dive in.

[00:00:55]

Hey-hey-hey, welcome back to another throwback Thursday episode of Collab With Kiva. This week we are throwing it back to my legal confidante, my legal ace, Nicole Cheri Oden. Why is this one of the most downloaded episodes of the podcast? Because having your legal house in order is so important, whether it's for things like grant opportunities that may come about, actually having your business set up properly with the right designations, with the right pieces in place, business, bank accounts, and so much more. They actually help you with things like certain certifications, certain grant programs, and certain opportunities that come available. And let's not get into the weeds about the fact that many of you as service providers have intellectual property that you may or may not be covering and making sure it's covered through trademarks and things of that sort.

[00:02:13]

So, if you are wondering if your legal house is in order as it relates to your business, make sure to tune in to this episode with Nicole. She makes legal easy to understand. She makes it readily accessible. She has amazing templates in her shop for covering you if you are a coach, a consultant, or if you have a podcast and you want to have podcast guests on. There are so many different aspects of legal that actually impact our business. And I just really think it's important that we are super aware of what those things are. Because as you know, ignorance of the law is not an excuse. So, tune in to this episode with Nicole. Take some notes, take some notes. There are some definite takeaways and make sure to check out the show notes for how you can get in touch with Nicole and also access her template shop. All right, guys.

[00:03:13]

Hello everyone and welcome to another episode of Collab With Kiva. Today I am so excited because I have a dear friend of mine with me and we are going to talk about some juicy stuff in the field of legal. So today's guest is Nicole Sherry Oden and she's an attorney licensed in the state of California for the last ten years. After four and a half years at a big firm, she became a mama to the most adorable little girl, I will say. She knew that if she wanted to be present while her daughter grew up, she had to make some big changes. She started her own law firm and spent the next two years learning how to actively create a work-life balance while teaching other women to do the same thing. So, after receiving countless questions from other online entrepreneurs, probably myself included, who were just so overwhelmed with legal, she pivoted into coaching to offer legal templates to take the expense and overwhelm out of the process for them.

[00:04:07]

Now, I know we don't want to devote all of our time, energy, and money to addressing legal issues. But as an entrepreneur, it is so essential that we are familiar with the legal requirements that do come with being a business owner, and that's why I love talking with Nicole. So, Nicole also works one on one with California-based business owners for custom contracts and policies, and she deals also with trademarks. Which is a whole nother conversation that we can definitely have. So, welcome to the show, Nicole.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:04:37]

Hi. I'm so excited to be here. I'm so excited for your launch. This is amazing.

Kiva Slade: [00:04:42]

Yes. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. So, tell us a little bit more about when it comes to business owners and legal, and especially for some people who are like, "I'm a solopreneur, it's just me and my business. What kind of legal responsibilities do I have?" Let's shed some light on that, should we?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:05:00]

Yes. I think it's amazing that the barrier to entry as a business owner is really low these days because of the online space. It's so easy to go buy a domain from GoDaddy, put up a website, put up a WooCommerce store, or even go with a Shopify or a Kartra store, and have everything all included and call yourself a business owner. That's wonderful. You're making money. But you're not thinking about those basic legal foundations that you need in place to protect your business, to protect your income, and really to protect your boundaries. And long term, especially if you're working with clients, but also in terms of if you're selling products, if you have somebody asking for a refund, what are those boundaries? Do you have a refund policy? There are just certain things that I find newer business owners aren't fully thinking through, and they're operating more on the wait and pray legal approach, which is, "I'm going to wait and pray nothing happens. And then when finally something does, then I'm going to deal with it." This is actually not a very smart strategy because it becomes so much more expensive to clean the mess up and then get protections in place after the fact than it would be if you had taken the time and made the investment early on to just get the basics in place. Now, of course, as your business grows, it expands, maybe you start hiring employees, your legal needs do shift, but you have to start. I am of the firm opinion that you have to start from day one, making sure that there are just some basic things in place.

Kiva Slade: [00:06:28]

I absolutely love that because there are ... Like, what's the refund policy? "I don't know. We make it up on the day." It's what it feels like sometimes when you're the person who's the chief bottle washer, you're the CEO, you're the accountant, you're the bookkeeper, you're your own marketing team. It does really feel like, "Oh, we'll just wait for something to break, in this case, something with legal, and then we'll worry about it." And it's just so not prudent. But one of the things I've heard you say is that legal is self-care for your business. And I know we talk a lot about self-care in terms of our spas or massages or taking time for ourselves. But when we're thinking about our business, what were, you say, three things that somebody really needs to think about when it comes to starting a business and keeping themselves legally protected?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:07:19]

Okay. So, there are two kinds of points I want to address. So, the first being, yes, I am a firm believer that legal is self-care for your business. And I like to phrase it that way because I think so many creative service-based business owners come from a place of their heart, and a lot of them will say legal is just too much for them. It's too legally, it's too scary. And especially for their clients, it would be overwhelming. But if you flip that script and really stand true to the fact that you're establishing boundaries, that's what's key. That's what legal is doing. Because legal, be it a written contract or policies for your website, it really is a two-way street. It's protecting you and it's protecting your client and establishing those boundaries. So, it's just something that you want to make sure that you're taking care of yourself at the end of the day and you're taking care of your business.

Kiva Slade: [00:08:14]

Taking care of yourself and your business. So, let's talk about contracts. I know that you've seen just like I've seen in certain Facebook groups, other online communities, people are operating their businesses without contracts in some cases. Sometimes these contracts are not written. There are verbal agreements that might be taking place. And then there are sometimes hurt feelings because one side or both sides are not having their expectations met. Why are contracts important in business?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:08:50]

Yes. So, it's important to understand that contracts can be both oral and written. And both can be enforceable. But I am a firm proponent that every single relationship in your business needs a written contract. And that is because when you have an oral agreement, it really does come down to he said, she said. And you're trying to piece together Facebook message conversations and email exchanges, telephone call recollections, looking at receipts that were paid. It just becomes a mess in terms of trying to piece together what the true expectations were and trying to show there was a meeting of the minds. Versus when you have a written contract that you can reference back to, to see what were the terms, what was the timeline, what were my expectations in terms of if I wanted to get out of the contract. Could I? If we do have a dispute, what's the process that we're handling the dispute through? Are we going to court? Are we potentially going to arbitration? And if that doesn't fail, does it become binding? There are so many what-if scenarios that may not be fun to piece together at the beginning, but are so necessary. So, I'm just a firm proponent that that written contract is key.

Kiva Slade: [00:10:21]

Definitely. For example, I have sometimes a subcontractor or an independent contractor. I have a contract with them. I also have contracts with my clients. Let's see here, contracts with vendors. For example, I know one of the areas that I've talked to you about was brand photography, because I was looking to do some updated pictures and things of that sort, and really felt that some of the contracts felt more personal than they did covering me as an entity or as a corporation and business. And when we're looking at that, is it wise, maybe, feasible, (I'm not even sure which word I want to use there) for us to have an ongoing relationship with someone who is an attorney? What would you recommend for business owners that have maybe multiple contracts or contract scenarios in place?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:11:19]

So, I always recommend that business owners meet with an attorney early on in their business to really just sit down and have a strategy session. Here's my business. Here's where I anticipate it going. What are the types of contracts I might need? What other types of legal protections should I explore? Maybe that's transitioning from an LLC to a corporation, because now we have brought on employees and we need different tax structures. Maybe I do need to explore copyright registration so that I can enter into a licensing agreement or obtain trademark registration because my brand is blowing up in the online space and I want to be able to send a letter to an infringer that has teeth in it. So, there are so many moving pieces, especially in the online business world, that are nuanced, even just from small business law. Having that clear outline early on is helpful. And then I always recommend actually doing a check-in annually with your contracts and with your relationships. Because relationships do change, agreements change, and you want to make sure that what you have in writing really mirrors everybody's expectations. And just having that continual relationship is something that a lot of attorneys offer. I offer legal strategy sessions. I know that there are other attorneys who practice law in the online business space who do the same. And I think just having that ability to send an email to an attorney and ask a quick question ... Is this something that I need to sit down and talk with you about, or is this something that we can revisit down the line? It's so beneficial.

Kiva Slade: [00:12:53]

I love that. Thanks so much. Now, here's a question. I think that some people might have. Some of us have working relationships where we might be based in the US and those that we interact with are based elsewhere. So, even if we have a contract, what happens if something were to happen? Just if. What should we think about? Is there a level of, hey, we have this contract, but I'm not really pursuing this? What are our options?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:13:25]

Yes. So, I think this reverts back to the conversation about why having a written contract is so key. So, if you don't have a contract, and let's say something goes wrong, there's a wrongdoer and let's say it's the person that you're working with and they live in a different country from the United States, that's where you're having to chase them down to file suit. It's not in the United States. It's where that wrongdoing happened. So, then you're having to pursue local counsel there, potentially working with local counsel here in the US to get conversations going and looking at what happened, piecing together which contract law prevails. Versus if you had the written contract from the beginning and had laid out in your dispute resolution provision that if we have a disagreement, the state of, let's say, for example, California's laws are going to be what we pursue and we're going to actually have arbitration in the state of California, in the county of Los Angeles, and this is how it's going to go. And you can be as detailed as you want to be in that dispute resolution provision to make sure it's something that you're not having to haul your cookies across.

Kiva Slade: [00:14:35]

Yes. Because no one wants to do that, right? But I think there is a level of, "You know, what, the wrongdoer, whoever it was, did X, Y and Z." Do you find that there's a high level of people who are like, you know what, even with a contract, I'm just not even going to pursue it, I'll just eat the loss and keep moving forward?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:14:57]

Yes. And I think that there is some cost-benefit analysis that comes into your consideration as a business owner. And this is where I like to refocus the conversation with clients. Because at the end of the day you can have all the legal protections in place, it's what you choose to do with them. And that can even be something so much as you have a no refund policy in your contract. You have somebody who asks for a refund and you just decide based on maybe what they're communicating with you, that you're going to give them the refund for just that good faith continued relationship after for some reason. And you decide to go against the provision. And you have the ability to do that, but you don't have to. And so, it's just something to keep in mind. It's that cost benefit. You really have to look at the whole picture. Does that make sense to file a lawsuit, go after somebody for $1,000? Probably not. Because the headache and the stress that comes along with filing in small claims court, and trying to get everything together, and whether you're going to do it yourself or find an attorney, it's probably not worth it. But, if you have somebody who's breached maybe a year-long contract and they owe you $50,000, the cost-benefit analysis might weigh in going forward with a lawsuit. It really is just a situational decision.

Kiva Slade: [00:16:14]

Right. I love that, though. So, now let's talk about something that I'll just say, I think I've been negligent in this area. I'll just come clean before I even ask the question. So, for those of us with websites, what's the stuff about privacy policies and being legal, and how much warning do they really need? Is that Squarespace-like template acceptable? Fill us in, Nicole.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:16:45]

So, data privacy legislation has been on the uptick the last ten years. People were getting savvy to the very smarmy online marketing tactics that people were using in terms of gathering a lot of what we call personally identifiable information or personal information about people on their websites, and about people that they were interacting on their email list with, and cold calling, cold subscribing people to their lists. And so, back in 2004, California actually became the first state to issue legislation that required businesses who do business online with California residents to have a privacy policy on their website. And it couldn't be something that was just hidden, that couldn't be found. It really has to be something that's accessible and noticeable and clearly lays out the information that's being collected and what you're doing with it. That really at the end of the day is what a privacy policy is. Flash forward to 2018 and the European Union took it a step further and issued the General Data Protection Regulation, which had very far-reaching implications, not only just for European Union, the EU, but really globally, because we have become a global economy.

[00:18:03]

And so, GDPR actually requires you to have a privacy policy, again, if you deal with people in the EU or EU residents, which an EU resident could be in the US, they could be in Canada, hence the broadening of the scope of this legislation. And it gave a lot of power back to the consumers in terms of can they ask for you to delete their information, can they ask you to correct it? Can they ask for you to report it to another third party on their behalf? So there's a lot of kind of expectations that are laid out in that legislation and people get very scared about it, but if you just come back to that concept of the privacy policy, tells people what information you're collecting and what you're doing with it that refocuses. There is a lot of legal language that needs to be in a privacy policy. And so, those generic outlines on website providers, be it WooCommerce or Kartra or Shopify or Squarespace or whatever it is that you're using is an outline, but it doesn't contain all of the information.

[00:19:12]

Because if you take that a step further, we've now had further legislation come out in California that basically mirrors GDPR but in different ways. Cookies are a big thing in the online space. And so, I'm sure we've all seen those lovely cookie bars that pop up when we visit websites. Because now you have to make sure that you are receiving affirmative consent to process personal information, basically, meaning somebody has to click a button that says, yes, I agree, you can collect blah. And personal information can be pretty expansive. Its names, email addresses. It's the IP address that your Google Analytics collects. So, pretty much if you have a website, you're collecting personal information and you can't run and hide from this legislation. Not to scare people, but ...

Kiva Slade: [00:20:05]

Hey, look, we have to put the facts out there as they are because there are. We all are familiar with the cookies that pop up and say, hey, are you okay with this? Or view how we're using which cookies ... and you can select or select those things that you do want to include or don't want to include. So, I think that this is so valuable. And especially since it feels like in the online space, it's like you said earlier, "Oops, I've decided on my name. I have a website. And I am now collecting money or I'm engaging in commerce activities with somebody over a service or a product." And it's like, yes, that privacy policy is probably something really stuck, like, Hey, this is what it is. And you're like ... And in some cases we probably haven't even read it if just comes with the website package so to speak.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:20:59]

And it's funny that you say that because I can't even tell you the amount of times that I've reviewed clients' privacy policies and they'll have something up, and it literally has like the brackets that say "Insert your company name here. Insert what you do with this information here." And I'm like, Oh, let's go back to the drawing board.

Kiva Slade: [00:21:19]

Absolutely. I love, though, that it's something that we have to pay attention to. Because there literally are laws and the laws are broadening and increasing. And because as consumers, when we put ourselves in that other hat that we wear as that consumer going to a site, we actually do want some level of protection and privacy with our information. And I've been known to hit the no, I don't consent button. And I still want to look at certain things on your website. So, it's one of those things that stepping outside of my business owner role, that if I do my consumer role, yes, actually, that's important to me. And I think it's like making sure that when we're in our business owner role, that we're thinking of those who do come and want to engage with us, what is the best thing for them.

[00:22:07]

And like you said, you know that self-care. It's like what protects us but also protects that particular or potential customer in this case. So, I love that you shared that. And I still need to possibly go look at my privacy policy. So, that's a takeaway for everybody today. So, I do want to touch on, though, businesses and trademarks. Because I feel like there is ... Maybe it's me, but maybe there are some misconceptions about what can be trademarked, what can't be trademarked, and what exactly is a trademark and how does it help someone? Because I've heard different things. Oh, you trademark after you're in business. People are like you can trademark something before you even use it. And let's not get into the fact that sometimes we put little TMs after things that we possibly just haven't even trademarked. It's like the ADT sign that's outside the house that doesn't have an alarm. So, I'm just wondering, what's your take on those?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:23:09]

So many things to unpack. So, let's start from the beginning about what a trademark is. So, a trademark really is a name, a word, a symbol, a graphic, something that ties to the source of products or services and commerce. So, if you think to your business name, your podcast name, the tagline for your business, the actual logo for your business, those things are trademarks. And from the time that you start using them, they're a trademark. The registration process is basically additional protection for your business that gives you the statutory right, meaning the actual legal right by legislation to actually pursue somebody for attorney's fees and damages if they infringe on your protected trademark rights.

[00:23:58]

And so, I am a big proponent of actually doing a trademark search before you even launch. And whether or not you decide to pursue an intent to use trademark application (and I'll talk about the difference between that and an in-use application in a second) or not, you really want to do your due diligence to make sure you are not infringing on somebody's trademark rights. Because then you're opening yourself up to a potential cease and desist letter and an expensive rebrand. And nobody wants to spend the money putting together their websites and all their social media branding and being out there doing their PR circuit, and then all of a sudden they find out that that business name is not going to fly because it actually is already in use. So, I think that that is a very smart investment and that can be with even digital products, your first name, if you have a smart podcast name that you want to make sure that you're protecting because you want to build a little empire on the podcast, those types of things, it makes sense to do that initial groundwork.

[00:25:02]

And so, I've referenced intent to use versus in-use application. So, there are two ways that you can register a trademark application in the United States. And one way is an intent to use application. So, that basically indicates to the United States Patent and Trademark Office that you have an idea, a trademark concept that you are going to put into action and actually be using in commerce shortly. You have to have this what they call a bona fide good faith intention to use, meaning you can't just squat on a name because you know somebody else is developing business and you want to be able to sell them the mark or whatever it may be. That's not going to fly. You're going to end up in litigation. But let's say you're coming out with a course, and it's going to be a big thing, and you've got this catchy name, and you've done your groundwork and you see that nobody's using it and you want to snag it before you even launch, you can file an application saying I intend to use it, and it does require some extra steps to get to the registration process.

[00:26:00]

But you have a leg up because you already have claimed the name. And now if somebody tries to come in and file afterward, you've got that first-person line filing deadline or dates. So that's an intent to use. An in-use application is when you're actually already using the trademark. So, the name of your business, your tagline, your logo, whatever it is, you're already using it. You're selling goods or conducting services, and you're ready to get that registration in place. So, two different paths.

Kiva Slade: [00:26:26]

Two different paths, but definitely paths that we should be mindful of. Because I love like you said, just even doing that research on the front end. Because I've seen people who've had to do rebrands because of the fact that what they were looking to use was already in use. And I think we have this misconception. It's like if we change at 10% or we do something else, that it's like this whole new thing and it's like, Whoa, I don't really think that's the way the law works, but okay.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:26:59]

Yes. There are certain concepts that you cannot trademark. You cannot trademark a generic name. You just can't do it because they don't want to prohibit people from using something that is so common in use. Descriptive names may not be trademarkable in terms of getting a registration. That doesn't mean it prevents you from using it. It just means you may not be able to actually get the registration. Adding the, or and, or an s to the end of a word, or flipping words, probably not going to fly because when you submit the registration application, an examining attorney is assigned to your application and they do a very thorough search of all the marks that have already been registered. You're probably going to get an office action that comes back and says, yeah, sorry, dude, we're, we're not going to register this because there is a likelihood of confusion with another registered mark.

Kiva Slade: [00:27:56]

So, that's the Coming to America, McDonald’s, and McDowell's. It's like, how did that even happen? That's because it's a movie, everybody. Don't go out there and try to do that yourself.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:28:09]

That's why it's so important to work with an attorney who has experience knowing what's different and unique versus what's too close that there could be an issue. If you think about Dove soap and Dove chocolate, which is a classic example, there are two completely different products with the same name. And that's fine. But you can't then next go and create a new company that ... Dove chocolates or something. It's just not going to fly.

Kiva Slade: [00:28:39]

It's not going to happen. Oh, goodness. Well, I am so thankful, though, Nicole, that you always are able to just break down what most of us might feel are complicated legal terms and really make us understand how they are applicable to our businesses and essential in our business toolkit as we continue to move forward. Even if we're thinking that, oh, we're kind of small, we don't have this, that or this going on, we still need to be mindful of those legal implications that really just come from how we're doing business in the space that we are doing business. So, for those that might be interested in whether it's a template or a privacy policy for their website that actually they fill out the part that's filled into the brackets of insert your company here, do you have something for those that aren't in California? How can they continue to either purchase a template or find out more about you?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:29:36]

Yes. So I actually have a legal shop at nicolecherioden.com. That is my LLC, my online business baby. And you can snag a template from your website policies, to a client agreement if you're a coach. A Non-disclosure agreement if you are contemplating hiring a contractor to come in and you want to maybe have a discussion about what your business entails before you actually offer them the spot. All those good things are there in the legal shop so you can snag them.

Kiva Slade: [00:30:06]

I love that. You can also snag a podcast guest release form. I may know something about that. Because let's be honest, if it wasn't for Nicole, seriously, and Suzanne Mariga ... Because I was on Suzanne's podcast, she was the first person, and she was non the first podcast I was on. She sent me this podcast. I was like, Whoa, what is this new fancy stuff here? And it was like, Wait a minute. And then I went to your site and I was like, Nicole has a template. So, this is a part of the process. And it's something that, like I said, I've been on multiple podcasts and it wasn't something that I signed. So, once again, it's just another thing as your business grows or as you start to implement new services, there might be something that you're overlooking, that you might actually want to have some self-care for yourself as it relates to that one, being a podcast guest release. I'm sorry for cutting you off because you were going to share. How can we connect with you for other legal matters? Well, I was going to say.

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:31:12]

I guess that ties back into that comment. Sometimes people do have questions. "Will this template work for me?" And you know what? I'm completely honest. Sometimes you need a custom contract for whatever the situation is or I just don't have something. I don't have every contract under the sun because businesses are so unique. So, if somebody has a question and they want to reach out and I can definitely point them towards a resource or perhaps an attorney in their state, they can reach out @Nicole @nicolecheriodenlaw.oom or they can contact me through nicolecherioden.com too as well, which has the template shop. And I am always happy to do that because I would rather see people making sure they're getting the correct legal protections in place than just completely ignoring it.

Kiva Slade: [00:31:53]

Yes. And she has a vast network. I have tapped into it a few times. And she has great referrals. So, all of those details will definitely be in the show notes. So, I want to say thank you again, Nicole, for sharing with us your wealth of knowledge as it relates to protecting ourselves and our business, and really our potential customers in what we do and keeping ourselves legally protected as well. So, thank you so much for sharing with us. Any last parting words?

Nicole Cheri Oden: [00:32:24]

I guess just thank you to you. This is an amazing process. And you're so conversational, so it was just hopping on and chatting with a friend.

Kiva Slade: [00:32:32]

Yes, I love that. And I have to make my way to California so we can really chit-chat. So, awesome. So, make sure you guys check out the show notes for more on how you can contact Nicole at her law firm and or her template shop. Because, hey, those contracts are definitely important and we want your privacy policies up to date. So, make sure you check out the show notes for that and we'll see you next time. Bye. Thanks for tuning in to this episode of Collab With Kiva. Each of us has a different path. And I hope that this episode gave you some takeaway that has left you inspired and motivated to keep pressing forward on your unique path. Make sure you subscribe so you don't miss out on any future episodes. And of course, your reviews on Apple are greatly appreciated. If you're a small business owner ready to start making data-driven decisions in your business, and you know that without the data, you're really just guessing, make sure to visit my website, the516collaborative.com, and let's schedule a time to talk to make sure that you can harness the power of data in your business. I'll see you next time. Bye.

Meet Kiva Slade - the Founder and CEO of The 516 Collaborative. With a unique background in high-power politics on Capitol Hill and sixteen years as a homeschooling mama, Kiva found her calling in the online business world as a trusted guide for entrepreneurs looking to build the business of their dreams.

Kiva's work began behind the scenes, orchestrating the back end of businesses and managing teams. But her inner data diva couldn't help but notice that small businesses needed help harnessing the power of data for growth. So she and her team set out to uncover and tidy up the data required to enable clients to grow their businesses confidently and easily.